Golden Gate Baptist Theological Seminary
Mill Valley Campus
E1311-01 Church Administration
Dr. Tom Jones
Spring 2002

Interview Analysis

Conducted with
the Youth MinisterThe Pastor

by

Chris A. Foreman
Box 780
April 3, 2002

(I have redacted names to protect the innocent)

Introduction:
I met with the Youth Minister who is the Youth Minister at The Pastor. We talked over lunch at the Dynasty Restaurant in Tiburon. We first talked in generalities about her job and her attitude towards it. Then I used the sample Critical Incident Questionnaire to direct the conversation toward specific incidents. the Youth Minister is "over 40" years old and has been a youth minister on and off for about 20 years. She worked at This Church for several years under a previous church pastor. She did not get along well with him and left her position. She worked elsewhere for twelve years and then returned to This Church as youth minister under the senior pastorate of The Pastor. She says she gets along marvelously with him. She said that it is difficult to come up with critical incidents over the past five years that she has been with This Church. the Youth Minister says that most of her youth are children of church members and that most church members are middle/upper class, college-educated, and Marin County home owners. In other words, her kids are mostly headed for college and tend to steer clear of big trouble. Her group runs from 6th grade through 12th grade, both boys and girls. This is quite an expanse to find common ground. Right now she leads between 30 and 35 young people. She says the more daily problems tend to be with the 6th , 7th, and 8th graders, but that more critical problems tend to be with the high schoolers. Typical problems deal with gossip, talking behind someone's back, and hurting someone's feelings. The Youth Minister has a Master's degree in Psychological Counseling and can stay pretty relaxed in the midst of excitable youth. She seems to enjoy what she is doing and has every intention to remain where she is at as long as she is able. She freely admits that she is a relationship kind of person and does not enjoy dealing with long range plans and budgets. I asked her questions using the questionnaire and below are her responses.

Summary and Analysis of leadership incident -- drug use during a ski trip:

Please relate an incident when leadership made a critical difference in the success of your experience as a church administrator.
I lead a ski trip a few years with about 30 young people. One of the high school girls came to me in private and told me that one of the boys was bragging about bringing some drugs with him. We confronted the boy and made him empty all his bags and all his pockets. We didn't find anything. I told the boy that I was going to keep an eye on him and I did. We both knew that he was under special scrutiny during that trip.

Were there other leaders that played a significant role in this incident?
Yes, there were four other adults along on this trip and three of them were with me when we confronted this boy in his room. I wanted them to be with me to verify my own actions and to help in the investigation.

Did you have any prior training or experience in dealing with this type of incident?
Yes, I was a drug counselor for a few years and I am not afraid to confront drug users. I understand that they are people with problems.

What was the most important factor that made you successful in this incident?
I think mostly that we were willing to respond quickly and fairly to this incident. Word got around that we would not tolerate this kind of behavior

Have you experienced any similar situations such as the one you described?
Not with this youth group, but like I said, I have worked with people who do drugs.

What leaders in your organization are most crucial to the success of your church administration ministry?
This is getting away from this drug incident, but The Pastor really sets the tone of leadership in the church. It's just great to work with him. We set the youth agenda together, and then he allows me the freedom to accomplish it in my own way.

How did you select your leaders?
We have paid staff. They are all expected to be leaders. We accept just about any adult or parent who wants to help out. We are not choosy, and I can't say that we've ever turned down a parent who wanted to help. With the youth, we just keep our eyes open for emergent leaders -- older kids who get respect from younger kids. Mostly we don't choose them, they choose us.

Analysis of this incident
Confronting young people is always hard. You want to push just hard enough to propel them along the right path, but not so hard that they are pushed away. I think that the Youth Minister handled this leadership challenge well. She tells me that his young man stayed around to graduation and there were no other incidents like this one. This incident turned out OK.


Summary and analysis of management incident -- losing track of money:

Please describe a specific incident when the management approach of your church administration ministry was critical to a success experienced by your church. Describe the incident and why the management approach made a difference in the outcome.
I have to freely admit that I am not a good manager. The Pastor and the church secretary help me out a lot. Last year we went on a mission trip to London. Someone gave me a check for $100 and I stuck it in my book. I discovered the check months after we returned from the trip. I felt real bad. This year we are going to London again. I have asked that the money portion of this mission trip be handled by the secretary. (She agreed). I feel that they are doing what they do well, so that I can focus on what I do well.

Why did you utilize this type of management approach?
Because I am a "klutz" at handling money. The Pastor, and The secretary, and other people in the church are helping me with this.

Have you found your management approach adequate to accomplish the tasks?
I'm sorry to say that my personal management approach is not adequate. I am fortunate to have The Pastor to help out with planning and others to help me with money matters. This is an approach that allows me to get close to the kids. I plan to be here a long time and they know it.

Is management structure adequate to accomplish the tasks?
Yes, we are accomplishing our tasks. I would like to grow beyond our present thirty. In some ways I wish we were more "seeker" friendly. Most of my youth were raised in the church. It is hard to keep someone in the group who does not have a clue about what Christianity is about. This is something that I need to talk to my youth about.

What are the basic components of your planning process?
We have regular leadership meetings every two months. The Pastor is very good at this. He always encourages me and doesn't talk down to me. We try to plan out a one-year calendar and make adjustments as we go. The whole church budgets in October for the coming year, and that's when we need to make our resource requirements known. This has worked out pretty well for the past five years. Only this past year have we seen a dip in the total budget.

Will you continue to use your present management approach?
I think that we will continue to use this team approach to management. I'm a bit embarrassed to need so much help in the management aspects of my youth ministry, but the rest of the leadership team recognizes my value and they are willing to support me.

Analysis of this incident
Most churches have a problem in finding an adult who relates well to youth and who is willing to invest her life in young people. the Youth Minister seems to be genuinely interested in this calling. Most churches do not have a problem in finding money managers. The church is wise to overlook her management shortcomings and allow her to focus on relationship.

Personal Reflections on the Incidents
These incidents seem trivial: a drug bust that found nothing and a misplaced check for $100. the Youth Minister should be thankful that in five years these are the two big things that come to mind. But I have seen her in action. She constantly jumps from one mini-crisis to the next. With adolescents, angst is the norm. There are always hurt feelings, unkind gossip, and petty jealousies. the Youth Minister speaks with conviction and with compassion to young people. She can relate to them as few over-the-hill adults can. A few weeks ago, I attended a talk by James Merritt in the GGBTS chapel. He said that "great preaching will cover a multitude of sins". I think that it is the same with a Youth Minister. If you love the kids and they love you, this fact alone will cover the multitude of sins -- sins which include losing checks. It is my feeling that a truly gifted leader will know how to both lead people and manage resources. These people are rare. In my army experience, commanders talked with affectionate distain of the "bean counters". Bean counters are necessary because their job was to put constraints on what we could do as leaders. I think that the Youth Minister is doing just fine and is fortunate that others have volunteered to count her beans. A leader who can lead but has trouble managing resources can become effective by enlisting the help of managers. However, a leader who cannot lead cannot long be effective even with the help of supporting managers. Human relationships are key.

This course in Church Administration is about "the minister's role in planning, organizing, staffing, budgeting, coordinating and evaluating the work of a congregation". A good leader should know how to do all these things at least to the level where he or she can supervise those who plan, organize, staff, budget, coordinate and evaluate. I believe that a senior pastor's most important job is choose an outstanding support team and delegate to them the day-to-day administration of the church. The Youth Minister is getting help and that's OK with me.